Topic: Attacking from behind question

Hi all, just starting to play with LotFP and have a few questions. Take this situation:

Specialist sneaks up behind an enemy and stabs them in the back, the specialist has points in Sneak Attack. Using the Grindhouse pdf as my source, page 10 says they get +2 to hit from behind. On page 59 they get another +2 to hit, the enemy loses dex and shield bonus to AC. Finally on page 166 (item U) the enemy gets a further -2 to AC. To summarise, the specialist is at +4 to hit, the enemy's AC is based on worn armour alone at -2. Is this a correct?

I am also a bit confused about surprise. Page 56 explains that characters are surprised on a 2 in 6 and surprise enemies on a 4 in 6 (which makes sense). Elves are surprised on a 1 in 6, but do they surprise enemies on a 5 in 6, or does it stay at 4 in 6?

Small points, but loving the system. About to use LofP to run Sinister Secrets of Saltmarsh for the family...

Re: Attacking from behind question

Yep, if the specialist gets behind a target unnoticed, they are well rewarded. Keep in mind though, Surprise can only happen in the first round of combat (barring very exceptional circumstances). Also the attacked from behind rule specifically states 'by an enemy he is not aware of', so unless the specialist has a really good plan for making an enemy forget that he's there, he only gets that bonus once (just walking around to an enemies backside isn't good enough). The checklist is:

Surprised the enemy? If yes, enemy AC is armor only -2.
Got behind enemy unnoticed? If yes, enemy AC is armor only, you gain +2 to hit them.
You are a specialist with points in Sneak Attack? If yes, +2 to hit with Sneak Attacks.

The only one that's specifically required to successfully apply the Sneak Attack multiplier (x1 if no points in Sneak Attack) is Surprise. The other two just make it better!

For Surprise, the base chance to BE surprised (for both characters and monsters/NPCs) is 2 in 6. Elves have a base chance of 1 in 6 to be surprised. You only give your opponent a 4 in 6 chance to be surprised (effectively a +2 chance) if you are well prepared for an ambush, being an Elf does not push that to 5 in 6. I would, however, argue that because Elves are described as being less often surprised, that they would be at only 3 in 6 chance when caught in a well prepared ambush. Also, there will be times where it's appropriate for the GM to grant automatic surprise (unconscious defenders, coitus interruptus, etc etc)

Re: Attacking from behind question

Cool thanks.

With the surprise thing, why then are 4 of the 6 pips on the character sheet blacked in?

Re: Attacking from behind question

Hi Marty & welcome!

Since skills use a "roll under" mechanic, Surprise does as well. The die pips really represent the character's chance to prevent surprise, so if a normal character rolls a 4 or less (4 pips) he's not surprised. You fill in one more pip for an elf so if you roll a 5 or less, the elf is not surprised, i.e., he's only surprised 1 in 6 times.

Does that help?

Last edited by Lord Inar (2013-01-15 23:14:06)

Re: Attacking from behind question

Ah, I see. Seems a bit back to front, but that is just the way I look at the world...

Re: Attacking from behind question

Lord Inar wrote:

Hi Marty & welcome!

Since skills use a "roll under" mechanic, Surprise does as well. The die pips really represent the character's chance to prevent surprise, so if a normal character rolls a 4 or less (4 pips) he's not surprised. You fill in one more pip for an elf so if you roll a 5 or less, the elf is not surprised, i.e., he's only surprised 1 in 6 times.

Does that help?

That should actually be the other way around, because it's roll under. A non-elf in a normal situation is only surprised on a d6 Surprise roll of 1 or 2, and an elf is only surprised on a roll of 1.